I guess because it’s been on for so long you can’t remove it. I understand that it’s highly unlikely that it will be removed. It’s simply frustrating playing the game how it was supposed to be played (spawnkilling) and thus causing the players being SKed to *think* it’s a bad thing. Adding a rule to it furthers these players thoughts.

Players that don’t venture from the OZ server would most likely believe that SK is a terrible thing and shouldn’t be done. Which isn’t the correct train of thought.

Sorry, but that’s not our main priority, it’s for the server to be an enjoyable place to play for the majority of users, with free-flowing games for the most part, not having whole maps where a stacked team drives the other one into the dirt at the same choke point, over and over, for 20 mins.

Regardless of spawnkilling, a stacked team will always drive the other one into the dirt at the same choke point, over and over, for 20 mins. You can see this every day on any ET server – it isn’t exclusive to OZ nor spawnkilling. Stacked, unstacked or even – everyone can spawnkill at any time regardless of team skill.

i agree, but kinda diagree.

There’s no real skill involved in SK’ing.

Tut ofcourse most people would take the chance to SK, easy kills (most of the time).

Incorrect. Of course the mouth breathing panzer sitting on the goldrush bridge as allies waiting for a fresh axis out of spawn to pick off doesn’t have much skill but timing airstrikes/grenades/team pushes and objective rushes can come down to the time it takes for the opposition to spawn.

A sole SMG spawn killer is facing up to 3+ people at once regularly – not very easy for any player.

i still believe sk is sad.

How so? Against OZ rules, yes. Sad? Definitely not.

On to the sk, sk will always be debated and there will always be QQ. Do all those that agree to sk being allowed also agree to being moved at admins discretion to the losing team if they are massively camped? That is about the only fair trade off I can see. If you can’t agree to that, then you are clearly just out to get the easy kills. The moving of players system would be good because if you don’t want to get moved, you will back off from spawn a bit and let them get out and about. If you are too gungho and want to kill as many in spawn as possible then you will get moved on that team and get creamed like the rest of them 😛

It’s strange how you mention ‘agreeing’ with spawn killing…you mean, agreeing with how the game should be played? Then yes, you could say I would agree with spawn killing.

I can see how lifting the rule could potentially destroy the server but I would only say that because the rule has been in place for a long time. I CAN TASTE THE TEARS ALREADY JUST TALKING ABOUT REMOVING THE SK RULE – it’s really a lot of tears.

The main problems that lie with spawnkilling and the rule itself are: (I only state this because they weren’t addressed)

Another point – it’s retarded enforcing the rule when the spawn may be a path to an objective, for example off the top of my head, beach, goldrush, oasis, adlernest, braundorf. I’m sure there are many more. By having NO SK you pretty much close off options for the allies.

Hugely change gameplay when spawns are basically off limits.

I don’t think you read my post carefully blusky, I said that for those that agree with sk, should agree to being moved.
I don’t mind either way if the sk comes or goes, I was all for getting sk allowed on the server a while ago but the simple fact is it probably never will.
People that play outside OZ either know that sk is permissible on that server or will learn the hard way. Either way, whatever people do on another server is their business and if SK is that important to some then they should go play on one that will allow it.
To address your question specifically about maps with spawns in the road, you are allowed to run through spawn, just not allowed to kill. Simple. So if you need to run through a non-cap spawn, figure out their spawn time and time your run that way.
Answer my question now, if we were to make SK allowed on the server, would YOU agree to being moved at admins discretion to the other team if they got spawn camped hard?
Either way I doubt it would come on board, however the ATB sounds good if we could make it auto switch people if the fairness level started to dip.

Cheers

One change that has been made is that a scoped rifle hs will kill in one shot.

Hackers that snipe suck. There was a particularly dodgy guy the other day on axis on the african tank map where they go to the airfield that was pwning allies hard with his K43. That’s about the time I went spec before joining axis.

Personally, I don’t mind sk either, however because it has been a rule for so long I enforce it, which also means on occasions warning myself when I realise I have, or someone informs me. I agree it changes gameplay a lot however the one thing I don’t want is the server to be emptied out and for it to die away due to unfair teams. If teams are fair then sk shouldn’t happen that much, I’m sure it will a bit, but it also gives an advantage to new players to get a good heads up and learn the map atleast 5 seconds from their spawn rather then being panzered inside it.

We could always start the transition partially by allowing sk with light weapons only, and no arty on spawns only? What you think about that?

@admiral, at least its easier to figure out who is hacking since it only takes one shot to kill em and you see 5 names pop up in a few seconds 😉
@BR, SK in small doses is fine, and the occasional sk in my eyes is fine, it is the excessive sk that we need to guard against. That is what we need to plan for now since it is inevitable in the end once we green light sk.
How about something like light weapons allowed, but if one side has the other side completely backed up into their spawn, we swap the best player/s over to the losing side to even it up. Either that or do we have the proper ATB scripts in place that base of K/D so we can do that if it is completely stacked to one side?

Cheers

Acutally there is a fair way we could do it :), we could let the power of ATB!!!!!!!! *drum roll*, Yes it used to just move you at any point in the map BUT with the new functionality with the nightly, you can set it to only move people to keep teams even up until 10 mins into the map or 5 mins or something like that. 🙂 We could base the balance of K/D Ratio (showing the most accurate statistic of skill on the server), and this would be used to balance us. Then we could allow sk and have teams continually balanced which could mean uneven teams but if it means a balanced game, oh well? Yes we can also set it to not allow the teams to become unbalanced.

Yeah I second the ATB. Fix the balance to base on team K/D and ATB auto-move people up to 8 minutes into map…

Not worry so much about the Lua sk scripts… They bugged up on goldrush axis spawn. Go with 4 seconds spawn invulnerability. Charge!

Heavy constant spawn-kill is mostly a sign of unbalanced teams. I don’t like SK though prefer to cure the problem not the symptom…

Just my few cents…. Maybe its the easy way to let etpub look after it 🙂

It’s impossible to stop ALL spawn killing.

To address your question specifically about maps with spawns in the road, you are allowed to run through spawn, just not allowed to kill. Simple. So if you need to run through a non-cap spawn, figure out their spawn time and time your run that way.

1) Surely you see how silly that is. It DIRECTLY cuts off a path of attack.
2) It’s hard to time it on maps that aren’t 20/30 seconds SO MUCH HARDER IF ITS 15 SECONDS D:
3) In this instance it angers players that actually have true intentions of reaching the objective
4) If stricter mods/admins are on, and they catch you in there, they now believe you are aiming to SK.
5) “SOZ just passin thru m8” Never got me dewarned, even if I was legitimately passing through and not aiming to get kills.

Answer my question now, if we were to make SK allowed on the server, would YOU agree to being moved at admins discretion to the other team if they got spawn camped hard

I guess I would move. The only time I get annoyed if its mortar/panzer(noobs) that are spawnkilling. Then again, why should I move? It isn’t my responsibility if the other team is getting smashed, but then again I realise it’s not as easy as telling the other team to aim better :P.

We could always start the transition partially by allowing sk with light weapons only, and no arty on spawns only? What you think about that?

Not to shoot myself in the foot or anything but put myself/ulti/joker/prince/chronic/steady eddy(lol hehehehehehe) etc etc etc and other decent players in front of a spawn we can take out half the team and still survive depending on the oppositions skill and our position.

I would be for this change but I agree that the player base as a whole are anti-SK therefore it would negatively effect the server and I don’t want to be the one blamed for directly ‘pushing’ people away from OZ because I brought up this issue and can easily spawn kill.

It seems the server is doomed to no sk forever then 😛
If someone does come up with a solution that can meet both parties half way, speak up now while the issue is hot and ready 😮
Perhaps something like pistols only in spawn or something?

Cheers

Not to shoot myself in the foot or anything but put myself/ulti/joker/prince/chronic/steady eddy(lol hehehehehehe) etc etc etc and other decent players in front of a spawn we can take out half the team and still

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL..ad infinitum.

On the Spawn Killing issue, I agree that Spawn killing is a part of the game and should not be overtly restricted. From my experience, it is not only the ‘pro’ players who are guilty of it, indeed, in the absence of said players, I have observed that instead the best of the good players remaining usually takes it upon themselves to spawn kill. I have witnessed, to no end of my amusement, that, hypocritically, the players that are usually the quickest to cry “SK” when being dominated by better players, are the first to spawn kill, or at least attempt to, when those players are not present.

In short, as has been stated ad nauseam, a team being spawn killed is usually part of the dynamic of Enemy Territory. The better team will rape the inferior team, if not at the (ill-defined) spawn boundaries then at the numerous chokepoints characteristic of every map in ET. There will still be players QQ-ing, it is a fact of the internet, if the aforementioned players don’t get used to it, then they will never improve and will continue to be owned at chokepoints and/or their own spawn.

2) It’s hard to time it on maps that aren’t 20/30 seconds SO MUCH HARDER IF ITS 15 SECONDS D:

make it 17 seconds cause 15 fits into 60 seconds too easy.

while i’m chiming in, defeating spawn camping on a pub is not really feasible.
for the same reason objectives often dont complete, a defending team would be unable to coordinate a break out of spawn. pub players do not have the focus.

i support spawn protection.

I agree with blusky that SK should be allowed (espesialy in a competition scrim where SKing is a vital strategy)

But on a ETpub server where the majority of players may not be as skilled and/or serious about frag counts and K/D ratios as a small minority of players, im not so sure.
Maybe they just wanna have fun, get some prac in to try and improve and such. But its definitely not fun or productive to be stuck in spawn for
20mins getting ur arse served to you by camping panzerers and leet smg frag heros. amirite?

A real hero would be a good player (with a bit of empathy) thats been on the dominating side to move to the other team and help them out a bit with
maybe some good advice and to show them how its done by example. If they find it in their hearts to do such damn good deed like that, hats off to them.

Oh well, I’m sure there will always be agreements to disagree about the SK rule whatever happens, but there must some sort of adequate compromise somewhere.

Just my opinion/2 cents/input.

Cheers.

Here’s the problem, as I see it, with my experiences on the OZ server.

People only follow RULES. You water it down to guideline, admin discretion, SK OK until it’s excessive, etc, then you are left with two things. SK, and people saying they won’t stop because it’s a rule. “Show me the rule that says that I can’t SK.” They don’t stop, you warn. “Dewarn me, blah blah” Forum post “Admin abuse, I was warned for SK when it’s fine, ask Fred & Barney they were on and say it wasn’t excessive SK”.

People do follow clan/scrim team alliances, and with SK allowed that is more likely to be scrim team alliances. hZd for example, not because I have a problem with hZd, it’s just a good example. 4 or 5 hZd on, they end up on the same team, backing each other up SKing. As blu said, you put Joker/blu/Ulti/Ramen together on a team backing each other up, a lesser opposition is screwed. Then an OZ mod/admin says “OK, stop the SK, it’s excessive”. Any action they make is then attacked by 4 people, and they back each other up against the mod/admin. A kick/mute/warn is challenged, global spammed against, etc. So now you have SK and everyone being annoyed by the fights and posturing.

That makes the server better how?
Isn’t this “need” already serviced by GA?
Do we really need just another GA server to add to the list?

A real hero would be a good player (with a bit of empathy) thats been on the dominating side to move to the other team and help them out a bit with
maybe some good advice and to show them how its done by example. If they find it in their hearts to do such damn good deed like that, hats off to them.

Here’s the problem their are no hero’s that play on OZ they would rather get their K/D up than swap side’s..
Tonight’s a great example of that.
Once again SK was rampant with at least 5 OZ members on, NOTHING at all said.. Yet I got warned for sking by rampage in Baserace, FFS the objective is right there at the spawn.. OH HANG ON I WON’T BOTHER WITH THE OBJECTIVE, FK I MAY HAVE TO SHOOT SOMEONE THATS JUST SPAWNED, OH FK NO. As I said Either make the server fken SK or get the Admin/Mods to fken enforce the NO SK rule…. Because at the moment the OZ SERVER is SH!T.

Stop b.tching all the time Mortified… on the server tonight you kept trying to backrage axis’ spawn then QQ about SK

For your info fgt I wasn’t complaining about that map, the map in question is The Port or whatever it’s called. Let me see Blusky (yet again), Keith (now isn’t he a OZ member) just to name a few, yet I get WARNED for SKing in Baserace it doesn’t make any sence to me, if your asking me it seem to be the few selected players that are PROTECTED SPECIES, and it’s starting to get FKEN lame.
What I’m complaining about is the Stacked teams yet nothing gets done about it now or ever, so what the fk is going to make it any different in the future??? I KNOW SWEET FK ALL