Intelligence VS Religion

[Sunncaeks]

All actions are void and worthless, for in the end, they have no real meaning.

Be your own god.

 

[arabidgypsy]

I Think, Therefore I'm an Atheist

 

[Abolisher]

its not faith, its blind faith. All i'm going to say, but i do love these augments
religion is not needed in this day and age it WAS ok to start moral grounding but now its not necessary. But it doesn't really bother me as long as people dont go all extremist on ya.

 

[the whole cake]

Welp, religion is quite a comical topic. Its funny because people get so wound up in it, but don't do much research.
An absolute enormous amount of religion is skewed or misinterpreted throughout history. Its quite right to say that its part of how religion works: It changes with time. Tradition pfft, thats what they all say.

Things we know today: Christmas, Easter, Sunday worshop, etc, are almost all taken from non-christian sources. Yet they are often quoted as being Christian.
You can tell that its all a scam because history shows that our current traditions and beliefs go back to earlier ceremonies which were non-christian.

For example Christmas is a direct ripoff of saturnalia. Which goes back even further relating to the position of the sun going below the horizon in the right place in the skyline this time of year to match up with a few funky stars, which follows along some story I forgot. But its to do with the 3 wise men Anyway:

Saturnalia became one of the most popular Roman festivals. It was marked by tomfoolery and reversal of social roles, in which slaves and masters ostensibly switched places, with humorous results.
Saturnalia was introduced around 217 BC to raise citizen morale after a crushing military defeat at the hands of the Carthaginians.[1] Originally celebrated for a day, on December 17, its popularity saw it grow until it became a week long extravaganza, ending on the 23rd.

If you still believe in Christmas, you'll get a kick in the balls when you read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturnalia#Saturnalia.27s_relation_to_Christmas

You'll find christians worshop 'the son'. This is a mistranslation from 'the sun'. If you look at the early church symbols it shows the Cross, but overlayed with the zodiac. You can tell its the zodiac because the son/sun is in the middle of it some times:

Early christian symbol, with zodiac around the center (celtic wheel cross) And Jesus on the cross:

The sun in the middle of the cross.
Oops I mean the son in the middle of the zodiac. Surrounded by the 12 signs of the zodiac/apostles. We're currently in the age of Aquarius according to some people. I dont know much about it but roughly this time we're meant to be switching to or have switched to the new age of Aquarius. Hence why all these zodiac & tarrot morons are called 'new age':

The 12 apostles again, in human form:

And dont even get cake started on all the astrological alignments & stuff that coincide with these "christian" holidays. Like easter and the like.

Seriously they're the same thing. Google for yourself. Or even ask your local church minister why Easter is marked on the pagan calendar, and everything happens to align with the solstices.
Cake can go ON... and ON... and ON....All it takes is a bit of thinking and you can see for yourself that it all goes back to stories made up around what ancient humans saw in the sky. Back when us as humans really worshiped the sun because it gave us light, warmth, food, life etc., and we measured time by watching the stars. We could tell winter/summer etc was coming by the positions of stars and made up stories to explain them. Like Ra and Horus in Egypt.

Seriously dudes half the bible is just ripped off stories which were in turn ripped off and it goes on and on. Its all bollocks. Very clever, but the institutionalization of this stuff by Christianity really made life hell for humanity.
The short answer is that religious people of any form are indeed idiots. They believe in a puppet show, when the puppeteers are already exposed. Its nearly 2010, grow the fkuc up.
The church burned people for saying the world wasn't flat
The church burns people for being pagan
The church burns people for being gay
The church discourages birth control
The church discourages abortions for rape-victims
Do you want to embrace this?? And with a history built on flimsy stories? Vote for the whole cake instead. I will be your leader. Boobs, drugs, heavy metal, alcohol....you name it.

 

[Trigger Happy]

Christmas does have pagan roots, there is no denying that. What is great though, is that on Christmas, there are millions of people that celebrate the birth of Jesus. How many remember the pagan beginnings? There are similarities in your story with Christianity and the sun god thing, but that doesn't prove Christianity doesn't exist because there are similar symbols.
Your point is still moot though cake, as your topic against one religion was using another

Cheers

 

[the whole cake]

Your point is still moot though cake, as your topic against one religion was using another

Hi trigger. I was using christianity as an example because its popular where we live. Insert religion here.
My point is that it drastically changes over time. What we do now wasnt what we did earlier on. The beliefs are way way different. Early christians didn't even celebrate christmas. It was heresy to do so.

There are similarities in your story with Christianity and the sun god thing, but that doesn't prove Christianity doesn't exist because there are similar symbols.

Silly triggy - youre missing the point entirely. The point is that this jesus story is just as flakey & fictitious as the pagan stories - because they are both alterations the same root cause.

THEY ARE STORIES BASED ON THE SKY, because the sky is a calendar and clock for early humans.


[center:2hlqxlii]My point here guys is that we know the root cause. Its illogical to debate the specifics of whether these spectacular entities could exist, when you already know where the idea to invent them came from.[/center:2hlqxlii]

So please.... quit the crap. Please quit pretending its all real. Flekzor is just going to own you every time. And I'll be right there too. Mmhmm flekzor make love to me baby.

 

[Black Racoon]

Although I am Catholic, one thing I don't agree in on nor understand is why the catholic priests cannot marry? I looked into it a while back and found it wasn't anything to do with god's way or anything but in fact the rules of the kings in the 15th century/16th? (not too sure of the time). It got altered so many times with many different royalty, so why does it still stand with the church today.. Not all christian priests DO NOT marry, and although it may be some what balsphemist on my part, the priests who do marry.. seem a little more... down to earth (no pun intended).

Cheers, BR

 

[Trigger Happy]

lol cake, that is hardly a fact. You cannot prove that there is no "higher entity" out there nor that I can prove definitively to you that there is one.
The idea came from the sky? Well in some religions sure, why not. In Christianity that is not so. Believe what you will, it is your choice :) But I think it is childish to try and put down anothers beliefs because you simply find them not to your tastes.

Cheers

 

[the whole cake]

lol cake, that is hardly a fact. You cannot prove that there is no "higher entity" out there nor that I can prove definitively to you that there is one.
The idea came from the sky? Well in some religions sure, why not. In Christianity that is not so. Believe what you will, it is your choice :) But I think it is childish to try and put down anothers beliefs because you simply find them not to your tastes.

Cheers

I'm not attempting to prove a negative. I quote myself:

Its illogical to debate the specifics of whether these spectacular entities could exist, when you already know where the idea to invent them came from.

I agree with you that its pointless attempting to shoot down other peoples belief systems, and arguing with the same terms when we all have the right to believe what we like.

My argument is that the root cause for these stories is already known, and is not up for debate. You can't just deny the existence of the zodiac and the age of these religions/stories any more than you can deny the holocaust.

We all have the choice in our society to choose our own path. We have the right to choose what stories we think should influence our morale and ethos. We all have the choice to decide for ourselves. We have the choice to make dumb decisions, even if others insist otherwise. I am in no way attempting to force any kind of belief structure on you any more than I am able/authorized to do so in our society (NZ/AUS/Commonwealth/Crown).

I wholeheartedly support your decisions to believe in what you choose to, because you are able to in our society. However what I do object to is the notion that I am oppressing you in some way by raising awareness of history, and root-cause analysis of cultural traits. We are all our own individuals, but we do share the same environment. We obey the laws put on us, however our privileges include the right to speech. And I say - religion bollocks and its time to learn from history and move on to better & brighter things.

 

[Trigger Happy]

I didn't say that you are oppressing me in any way, those events occurred as did those in the Bible. How does the literature that you gain this information from become more truthful/factual than what is in the bible? What is funny is that the Saturnalia gods are based from the bible. What I was saying however, was that for those who say something like, "Islam/Hindu/Christianity is just a bunch of fairy stories" are rather ignorant. That was just my opinion as was yours to saying that religion is bollocks. We are all entitled to our opinions :)

Cheers

 

[Antagonist]

so in summing up triggerhawk is ned flanders?
would explain alot....

i actually admire a person who can see religion through in todays world, your father a minister or something?

 

[G-Train]

You all should read some Graham Hancock books(Fingerprints of the gods, Underworld, Keeper of Genesis etc).

Cake is onto something......

 

[Sunncaeks]

Cake is onto something...

Cake is a God amongst men.

Also, I shortened the amount of dots needed for an ellipsis.

 

[the whole cake]

I didn't say that you are oppressing me in any way, those events occurred as did those in the Bible. How does the literature that you gain this information from become more truthful/factual than what is in the bible? What is funny is that the Saturnalia gods are based from the bible. What I was saying however, was that for those who say something like, "Islam/Hindu/Christianity is just a bunch of fairy stories" are rather ignorant. That was just my opinion as was yours to saying that religion is bollocks. We are all entitled to our opinions :)

Cheers

The zodiac predates the bible. Christianity is a very new religion, dude. Satanism even younger. Wiccan younger still. If you deny this then you're leaning very close to the holocaust denier zone.

Its what I mean about the root causes already being known. There's nothing to actually debate. The zodiac is old as my granddads socks. We don't literally believe the stories of the zodiac, because we know that theyre based on stars in the sky. The stories, characters and themes in the bible are largely blurred versions of the zodiac stories.

You wont last long if you hint in any way that the bible predates the zodiac.

 

[Antagonist]

*sits back and waits to embrace some frogma wisdom*

 

[Trigger Happy]

Eh all I was saying that in your Saturnalia argument, which is a fairly new "tradition", that festivals deities were based from the bible or if you'd like a better way of saying it, are found within the bible. I wouldn't be stupid to say that Christianity is the oldest religion, we know that isn't true. Egyptian religion is one of the oldest I think from memory, or Hinduism. Just because a religion is similar hardly makes it a copy of others Cmon now cake, think of the Egyptian religion for a start. Now do you think that the Aboriginal religion stole it's stories from it? They are both based on the stars and what not, so clearly they must be a copy. So again, believe what you like and the Zodiac being the basis for all religions, but I will choose to believe in a God that created the Zodiac constellation in the first place :)

Cheers

 

[Sunncaeks]

A God that created the Zodiac which was formed before that God who created it had been created?

Makes perfect sense.

 

[the whole cake]

Eh all I was saying that in your Saturnalia argument, which is a fairly new "tradition", that festivals deities were based from the bible or if you'd like a better way of saying it, are found within the bible. I wouldn't be stupid to say that Christianity is the oldest religion, we know that isn't true. Egyptian religion is one of the oldest I think from memory, or Hinduism. Just because a religion is similar hardly makes it a copy of others Cmon now cake, think of the Egyptian religion for a start. Now do you think that the Aboriginal religion stole it's stories from it? They are both based on the stars and what not, so clearly they must be a copy. So again, believe what you like and the Zodiac being the basis for all religions, but I will choose to believe in a God that created the Zodiac constellation in the first place :)

Cheers

Im getting sick of re-explaining the same point here. I never said the zodiac was the basis for all religions. You arent reading my posts are you? Other religions exist without influence of the zodiac. So what? How does their existence negate or enhance the authenticity of any religion at all?

If your religion isnt the oldest, then wtf are you bringing to the table in this discussion? My point of major religions being similar due to having the same root cause was just an example proving that they are fictitious. The bible has gone through a zillion revisions since you laid eyes on it in 2009. You can't just alter history when you change the stories in books. So you must go back in time to earliest revisions.

I brought up the zodiac because its the earliest I am aware of personally. I just dont think youre reading my posts. I already mentioned Ra and Horus. I think this thread should be locked because its getting repetitive. Unless someone adds something new the cake will call the mighty thread locking gods.

 

[the whole cake]

I have summarized this discussion and provided Trigger with a comprehensive counter argument, with the same amount of effort and intelligence that he has provided to me.

 

[Trigger Happy]

My point of major religions being similar due to having the same root cause was just an example proving that they are fictitious.

Doesn't really prove squat one way or another in any sort of factual manner But I agree, this thread is really going nowhere. I think we just have to agree to disagree :)

Cheers