• Changes to Server go to this thread http://overzealousgamers.com/threads/etpub-changelog.6665/
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Oz mod development

Covert

Well-Known Member
#61
You're missing the point there ted, defensive mines aren't what people complain about. It's when people on allies are able to plant 12 mines to spawncamp.. That is just ridiculous. How fun is it when you just walk out of spawn and trod over a bunch of mines planted ontop of eachother, it's instant death. Maps like grush, oasis and adler where more often than not you will have allied teams planting all 12 mines available either ontop of axis spawn or back towards there own and just sitting in there waiting for people to walk over them is quite dumb
I'm with you getting spawncamped by smg can be quite fun, but it sucks when you get a med that either sits behind a corner with 20 med packs under his feet or can just instant heal with the amount of med packs available to lvl 4 meds.
Attacking teams mines should be reduced - as there is little to no need for the attacking team to use them. Reducing the amount of healing medics can do would make life better for everyone too because its just too imba(I'm sure everyone remembers getting pumped by meds with stupid adren).
 

JoKeR

Well-Known Member
#62
Get rid of sk rules.

Make landmines visible.

Remove being able to kick arty.

Ban Matilda.

^^ Make OZ great again.
:trump:
 
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#63
The reduction of mines is an incredibly single-minded and selfish suggestion by highly skilled players that are batting at a kd several times greater that of the low skilled players.

This server has low skilled players. It's pub. The majority of us here aren't good, and mines are very occasionally the only weakness of good players that conduct the nightly slaughter of the server's players using SMG. A slaughter which I don't mind, incidentally. It's actually a fun challenge. I suck it up and just keep trying, not lobby endlessly for tweaks that will improve my game at the expense of others'.

The richness of weapons currently available strikes a good balance and has helped create OZ's unique blend of both high and low skilled players together on the one server. Less than 12 mines will make a lot of maps far less defendable. Please leave them be.
Listen to ted.

Why listen to pro players that don't even play anymore!??
 
#65
Make a list and check it twice~
  • Panzer able to be had by both teams when its 5/6
good idea

  • Rnades and mines to count as heavy weapon spawn killing
Only mines. I've never known rnades to be a big issue re spawn killing. Also you don't want weaker players leaving the server due to being unable to get a kill.

  • Medics can't self heal x time after being shot (may not be doable with present version)
  • Adjust teamdamage threshold, after x amount, kick
fine.

  • Bring back playdead
yes please

  • Reduce amount of panzer self kills for shooting medpacks
4 is a reasonable number. No need to change this.

  • Lower mines - 10 - 6, dynamically based on amount of players would be preferable
See ted's reasons for leaving unchanged.

  • Reduce charge times across the board
fair enough.

  • Airstrike cans do not change ownership when kicked



Why change this? It's fun trying to kick the can and having it change ownership.
 
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Teddles

Well-Known Member
#66
You're missing the point there ted, defensive mines aren't what people complain about. It's when people on allies are able to plant 12 mines to spawncamp.. .
How about we remove medic's ability to self pack? Because when I was playing, some medic just kept running away from me packing! And I didnt like it, so I demand permanent changes now!

Get rid of sk rules.
I'd be interested to see how this goes. How about a non-binding 1 month trial or something?

(The remainder of Joker's suggestions are garbage, pls ignore)
 
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Covert

Well-Known Member
#67
How about we remove medic's ability to self pack? Because when I was playing, some medic just kept running away from me packing! And I didnt like it, so I demand permanent changes now!
Reduce, not remove. Same with attacking teams mines. Reduce, not remove :p
 

cccdfern

Administrator
Staff member
#70
How about we remove medic's ability to self pack? Because when I was playing, some medic just kept running away from me packing! And I didnt like it, so I demand permanent changes now!
Guess I should chip in about never being able to kill meds with a flamer.

Attacking teams mines should be reduced - as there is little to no need for the attacking team to use them. Reducing the amount of healing medics can do would make life better for everyone too because its just too imba(I'm sure everyone remembers getting pumped by meds with stupid adren).
Config wise I can't find a way of reducing how much packs heal, nor that lovely thing with mines. These may be able to be done with code/lua, Triggs?
We can reduce medic charge, what they get at which level and how many they drop on death (there are more, these just seem most relevant)
 
#71
Interesting points being made across the board here. I think that if we are looking to reduce the mines / engies / whatever low skilled players can spam then reducing the ability to self heal is good idea. It just means it forces rambo meds to get a friend or to start having to run to the racks a bit more.

@Fern in terms of the medic stuff, you can set the g_medics bitmask to stop being able to self pack, but if you wanted anything more fancy it would need some coding. I don't think you can change the amount of health a pack gives you without custom stuff. As a balancing move though, I think we should enable adren for medics if we make it that they can't pack themselves. It might be an even enough exchange there (or does that still favour medic too much?).

Removing spawnkilling rules are ok I think, but I can see it being a quick way of increasing rage spec / rage quits. If you're already backed into spawn and getting smashed by smg and rnade campers, having panzer, mg42 and arty spam could be a lot for people to handle. If we nerf everything to the point of being useless on spawns, it could also really change the balance of games in general...it is a tough one to tinker with!

Might just need a lot of trial and error to find a good balance of all things. Maybe just pick a new thing that has been brought up to tweak each week and see how that affects gameplay?

Cheers
 

Teddles

Well-Known Member
#72
How about for all mod changes, we figure out a way to have voting in the forums. Leave the vote open for a week, 1 member per vote, see what the consensus is.

-- regards,
Crooked Ted
 

Ulti

Well-Known Member
#73
I think that if we are looking to reduce the mines / engies / whatever low skilled players can spam then reducing the ability to self heal is good idea. It just means it forces rambo meds to get a friend or to start having to run to the racks a bit more.
the reduction of self healing is a great idea which will counterbalance your "Rambo Medic Situation" but reduction of charge time will also combat this, removing it will most likely make the medic class obsolete, might as well just go field ops.
  • Rnades and mines to count as heavy weapon spawn killing - Great idea, unless your scrap SK rule altogether, there was already extended spawn shield to protect you
  • Bring back playdead - can i suggest a timer? playdead spam can be exploited sooooooooooooooooooooo hard
  • Lower mines - 10 - 6, dynamically based on amount of players would be preferable - i liked coverts idea about limiting the ATTACKING teams mines, but something def needs to be done about it especially when you can't see them :facepalm:
The reduction of mines is an incredibly single-minded and selfish suggestion by highly skilled players that are batting at a kd several times greater that of the low skilled players.
i dont see how that is single minded or selfish, landmines are very powerful and not being able to see them changes the balance and dynamic. BALANCE is the key whether your a high skill player or low skill

I think we should enable adren for medics if we make it that they can't pack themselves. It might be an even enough exchange there (or does that still favour medic too much?).
I think if i remember correctly its close to 250 damage to kill a person on adren.. + they get that extra movement speed, i think that would throw off the balance a bit as well

P.S nice to have a decent topic to debate on again :trump::trump::trump:
 

Covert

Well-Known Member
#74
Was 265 for adren meds i think, add that with the unlimited sprint and its a near unkillable thing unless you're another med on adren. Reducing charge time is the key there
Definitely mines should either be visible or not allowed for sk. 1 rnader isn't such a bad thing but when you have 3 on a team of 6 peppering spawn it gets a bit shite
Trial and error over a vote - not everyone who plays jumps on the forum and vice versa
 

Teddles

Well-Known Member
#75
i dont see how that is single minded or selfish, landmines are very powerful and not being able to see them changes the balance and dynamic. BALANCE is the key whether your a high skill player or low skill
That's easily balanced out by a covie spotting mines - unless we're aiming to distil the game down to medics only.
 

cccdfern

Administrator
Staff member
#76
On adren, there is a setting to allow medics to adren others and not themselves.

Also, it would be preferable if we could get input from other players on the server who don't frequent the forums, only play. As they will bear the brunt of any changes.
 
#78
Also, it would be preferable if we could get input from other players on the server who don't frequent the forums, only play. As they will bear the brunt of any changes.
Well Mat, Triggs, Ted, Topcat, Wombat and me have had a say so I think that pretty much covers the set of all currently playing players AND who make the time to comment on the forums (short of dragging them into the dungeon)...
 

cccdfern

Administrator
Staff member
#79
Well Mat, Triggs, Ted, Topcat, Wombat and me have had a say so I think that pretty much covers the set of all currently playing players AND who make the time to comment on the forums (short of dragging them into the dungeon)...
Thats kinda my point though, we have a quite a few others who play and should have some form of input
 
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#80
Fair point ulti. Perhaps just reducing the recharge time is the way to go. I forget if we can do this individually or not or if it is across the board. Realistically though, if we just make the recharge time quite slow, it would probably even all classes out (albeit really annoyingly! haha). You could have 6 rnaders but they could only fire off one shot every what, 20 seconds? Same for panzer, medic could only rambo pack once before they are screwed and have to hide for ages. Arty would only be able to be called once every few minutes through binocs and so on.

Adren could be a bit overkill, unless again we make some changes to the code to make it less OP perhaps. I think it's all trial and error, maybe having a forum vote or at least a forum post per change so we can track general feelings on stuff. Not everyone is going to agree on any change we do (there will always be someone who hates the change) but hopefully we can get some of the regs who are on to give an impartial view of how they saw the games to be in terms of positively or negatively influenced.

The other factor to consider is that games in smaller numbers, say 3v3, will have different affects to games were it is 5v5 or upwards. Game balance is something all game designers have battled with since forever, so I doubt we can crack the perfect balance without a fair amount of effort and QQ from a lot of people! :)

Cheers
 
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